GU43 UI Changes

[Zoltaroth-SOE]

+ G15 Support (I will let Rothgar talk about this since it is his baby)
+ New DynamicData: [added for G15 support but can be used else where]
* Spell reuse timers and names are now available in dynamic data, from your hotkey bars

* DynamicData.SpellInfo.Bank_X.Key_X.Name – Name of spell or macro

* DynamicData.SpellInfo.Bank_X.Key_X.ReuseText – Reuse time formatted “5 minutes 6 Seconds” if (cl_g15_short_units is 0 ) “5 m 6 s” otherwise

* DynamicData.SpellInfo.Bank_X.Key_X.ReuseSec – Reuse time in seconds

Example of my custom G15 Page for spell reuse:

<Page BackgroundColor="#333333" BackgroundOpacity="1.000" Location="9,312" Name="Reuse" ScrollExtent="160,43" Size="160,43">
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_4.Key_10.Name" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Name="SpellLabel" ScrollExtent="86,14" Size="86,14" TextSize="1">Bank 1 Key 1</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_4.Key_10.ReuseText" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="84,0" Name="SpellValue" ScrollExtent="73,14" Size="73,14" TextSize="1">1000</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_4.Key_1.Name" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="0,9" Name="SpellLabel" ScrollExtent="86,14" Size="86,14" TextSize="1">Bank 1 Key 3</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_4.Key_1.ReuseText" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="84,9" Name="SpellValue" ScrollExtent="73,14" Size="73,14" TextSize="1">1000</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_5.Key_12.Name" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="0,18" Name="SpellLabel" ScrollExtent="86,14" Size="86,14" TextSize="1">Bank 3 Key 3</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_5.Key_12.ReuseText" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="84,18" Name="SpellValue" ScrollExtent="73,14" Size="73,14" TextSize="1">1000</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_4.Key_7.Name" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="0,27" Name="SpellLabel" ScrollExtent="86,14" Size="86,14" TextSize="1">Bank 10 Key 12</Text>
<Text AbsorbsInput="false" DynamicData="/GameData.SpellInfo.Bank_4.Key_7.ReuseText" Font="/TextStyles.Small.SmallStyle" Location="84,27" Name="SpellValue" ScrollExtent="73,14" Size="73,14" TextSize="1">1000</Text>
</Page>

[gm9]

Thanks, you can upload your mod to the download sections.

Since you already have cl_g15_short_units, maybe we could get the same for use in the UI, eg on the maintained window, either as a general parameter or as a parameter of the UI element or even as a DD filter?

[Chrislau]

Usable items' reuse timer cannot display correctly on hotbar window.

[Zoltaroth-SOE]

Originally Posted by Chrislau

Usable items' reuse timer cannot display correctly on hotbar window.

I'll take a look at this today I have a feeling it's related to these being a different type of hotkey button.

[Zoltaroth-SOE]

Checked in a fix for items on hotbars today should be in the next GU.

[lordebon]

I disagree with corpses never "disappearing".

Corpses need to poof. Epic corpses last a long time and thats fine with me but they should never poof _EARLY_. Thats what happened last night, where the epic mob's corpse disappeared in about 3 minutes instead of sticking around for the full epic duration. I still don't know why that happened.

And the reason I posted here was it was the best forum I could think of, and since the thread was titled GU43 UI changes (even if the initial content was more specific to the keyboard) my comments on, ui changes, fit in with the title. That and I can't start threads in this forum

Zonx pretty well restated my intention, with the exception of corpses.

The only change I'd make regarding corpse poofs (besides fixing whatever caused it to poof early, GRR!) would be that epic mob corpses do NOT poof until their timer is up. IE that way you can loot whatever is on them without them going poof until the timer is up. Absolutely no change needed to spells because the same # of corpses will be there as before for those raids that didn't touch corpses, only now not even the little 'junk' loot is wasted.


Oh one last thing -- I believe Vanguard has the code for NBG that depends on classes (I played it back when it came out and I recall it having that) so maybe ask them how they do it? hehe =)

[lordebon]

Sorry guys but I gotta call you out on the whole NBG / loot window changes.

You guys generally do great work but this just needs some serious change... in my opinion its actually made it more possible for someone to take loot they don't "Need" by simply hitting that button when everyone is properly hitting "Greed" -- at least before on a "FFA" call everyone would still roll.

Proposed changes that would make the NBG system really shine in my eyes:

First -- when using round-robin, coin that is split amongst the group is counting as a persons turn, which is completely unacceptable.

Second -- There absolutely needs to be an option to allow "No-Trades" to default to NBG and override any round-robbin settings.

Third -- The "Need" option should only be usable when the person can physically use the item. In other words, "Need" should only be clickable if:
a) It's a piece of armor their class can use (don't need to check level, just class)
b) It's a spell/ability they can physically scribe (this can extend to recipe books as well as adept 1s and masters)
c) It is a quest update for a quest that they currently have
d) It is a quest starter for a quest they do NOT have (but if it is not repeatable, then they cannot "Need" it if they have it completed. If its repeatable they can "Need" it again if they've finished it then)
e) It is an item that, for whatever reason (epic update, whatever) is visible to them but not to others.
In all other circumstances (ie trash loot like guild status items and such) "Need" would be grayed out and you would only be able to "Greed" on it.

Fourth -- Opening a corpse with leader-only loot that contains an item a member of the group needs SHOULD ABSOLUTELY POSITIVELY CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH NOT vanish the corpse. Instead the leader should see the item but only have options to assign it to the person that can "see" and use the item. This is an issue with warden mythical epic updates for one thing, and possibly others.

[Zonx]

Not sure why this post was moved from Dev Shack (edit: and back), but...

I was speaking to the new Tech Director at SOE about these same issues.

Round-Robin: Coin should only count as a person's turn if auto-split is off and that person gets ALL coin from a chest/corpse.

No-Trades: When a player has the option to loot no-trades they should ALWAYS see a loot window AND confirmation dialog, regardless of rairity, quest starter, or round-robin settings. NBG on no-trades for the loot window is preferable to lotto, but silent round-robin is completely unacceptable. It is NEVER ok to silently award any no-trade item. See notes on "Smart Offers" below.

Corpse Loot: Corpses should NEVER poof until completely emptied. There is at least 1 spell line currently in-game who's effect depends on nearby corpse count and you may want to introduce other corpse related abilities later "Annimate Dead" for example.

Smart Offers: Lordebon covered this in his Thrid point but I think it can have more general application. I'd love to see elligability code applied to the list of items offered to a player in all loot scenarios. Lordebon's list is great for NBG. I'd apply the following from his list to Lotto and Round-robin... c, d, e. The idea here is to reduce the amount of pointless window spam, but you need to be careful not to prevent looting stuff that might for instance be melted down by a transmutter or sold for cash.

Loot Visibility: There should be a Game Option to hide/show items you are not eligable to loot. There are cases where I want to see what's in a chest even if I personally can't loot it. In these cases, those items need to be clearly differentiated from items I can loot. Could be as simple as a red box around the icon. This also applies to leader-assigned loot, leaders should see an obvious indicator that they personally are not elligable to loot an item in the list.

Leader Assigned: Deffinetly would be nice to have the assignment list filtered based on elligability. If a Conjuror epic quest updater drops, selecting that item should filter the group/raid list to just the conjurors.

[gm9]

I'll agree with all that lordebon posted - with Zonx' qualification on coin.

Corpses are already persistant in instances, but making them persistant in overland zones would probably be a huge strain on the server. Some might never ever be looted and CL will be littered with dead orcs.

On "smart offers", I don't think it has reason to exist outside of NBG. If your group does non-NBG round robin or lotto, that means you consider all loot as FFA and therefore per se you are eligible for everything.

On loot visibility, I don't think I would ever want to hide loot I'm not eligible to loot. Marking items your class cannot use is not a bad idea however.

Leader assigned list filters would be great to easy the pain of finding someone on that list. However, you need to be able to turn it off if you want to assign it to a transmuter or someone who distributes no-trade after the raid.

PS: Zonx, the move/move back was because the OP was about G15 only and it might have been better to start a new thread on the loot window (which might start a huge discussion judging from what I saw on other sites), but after Chrislau's post I changed my mind, might as well make this a general feedback thread...

EDIT to add: Any of the SOE devs feel free to drop me a PM if you have any preferences on how this part of the forum is run - it is after all mainly supposed to be useful to you.